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PostPosted: Wed Dec 17, 2003 9:39 am 
Cunning Rogue
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CountZero and those in the know:

So what are the changes DP9 has in mind for HG with the impending release of the CORE Tac rules? I'm curious since I'd like to get my feet wet, but I also have an aversion to getting started at the tail end of things.

Daniel



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 1:11 am 
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Effectively the new SilCore Tac is going to have the rules for every kind of miniature gaming (at least that is the plan). It will have stuff for HG/GK style games. Currently I am writing up a set of rules for 25-28mm scale infantry skirimish rules for the book for Robert Dubois...at least he has asked to seem them... and it will also have rules for space ships and napoleanics... at least that is the plan. Plans change, but they wanted to produce a rulebook that would cover every genre so they could just put out setting books.

Jonathan


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 9:35 am 
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Jonathan,

One more question. What are the differences between the combat rules for gears in the HG:RPG and HG:Tac? In Jovian Chronicles, the white book space combat rules were pretty heavy duty and thus the release of Lighting Strike. Is this the same reason for the HG rpg and tac rulesets? Thanks.

Daniel



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When a cat is dropped, it always lands on its feet, and when toast is dropped, it always lands with the buttered side facing down. I propose to strap buttered toast to the back of a cat. The two will hover, spinning inches above the ground. With a giant buttered cat array, a high-speed monorail could easily link New York with Chicago.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 10:09 am 
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Another question for CZ:

Since Foxbat and I have decided to start playing HG at the turn of the new year, do you have any suggestions as to where to begin as far as forces/figures? You know, how many figs for a good starting point? What factions work best for newbies? That kind of thing.

Just trying to figure out how much this is gonna cost me. :(



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 1:22 pm 
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Good question Gotetsu. Checkout http://www.dp9.com for some background info about the more common gears. After reading that and reflecting on the hours I spent play HG2 on the PC I'm leaning toward the southern faction's equipment.

Daniel



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When a cat is dropped, it always lands on its feet, and when toast is dropped, it always lands with the buttered side facing down. I propose to strap buttered toast to the back of a cat. The two will hover, spinning inches above the ground. With a giant buttered cat array, a high-speed monorail could easily link New York with Chicago.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 10:00 pm 
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Foxbat wrote:
One more question. What are the differences between the combat rules for gears in the HG:RPG and HG:Tac? In Jovian Chronicles, the white book space combat rules were pretty heavy duty and thus the release of Lighting Strike. Is this the same reason for the HG rpg and tac rulesets?


Well the rules for HG:Tac are more focused towards Tactical. They have scenario generation and infantry rules (especially compared to the SilCore). It will also have the Threat Values when compared to the current HG books. The old ones still have TV though.

The Lightning Strike rules and hard space rules will be in the book as far as I know. The hard space rules are intended for those who really want realism. They are only intended for a few models at a time. Might be good for about 4-8 models per side (like fighter combat).

Jonathan


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 10:16 pm 
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Gotetsu wrote:
Since Foxbat and I have decided to start playing HG at the turn of the new year, do you have any suggestions as to where to begin as far as forces/figures? You know, how many figs for a good starting point? What factions work best for newbies? That kind of thing.

Just trying to figure out how much this is gonna cost me. :(


Okay in deciding what forces to play he is the basic breakdown:

Northern Forces - Really powerful tanks, and agile gears. The Northern equipment is very much so about precision. They have heavy guided weapons on most of thier gears. The Cheetah is really hard to hit and the Jaguar, Hunter, and Grizzly work really well together. The Aller main battle tank carries a heavy rail gun which drops most targets in one hit. Two if it gets a bad shot.

Southern Forces - southern equipment focuses and being brutal. They have high damage indirect weapons. precision isn't really their strong point but they can fill an area with so much fire that it becomes a death zone. The Visigoth MBT has a heavy field gun which can deliver nasty indirect fire. The Southern forces don't complement each other as well, except the Black Mamba and the Iguana. The Igauna and the Black Mamba have very similar movement so they can keep pace with each other. They make a deadly combination.

Colonial Expeditionary Force (CEF) - The CEF has high tech weapons and equipment. Their Battle Frames are deadly and very accurate. They can't take hits as well has Terra Novan gears but they can cross the table very fast (4-5 times faster than a gear). The CEF hovertanks are both curse and a blessing. They are very powerful but easily killed when outnumbered. The CEF relies upon combined arms. Additionally, thier infantry carry laser rifles and the GREL infantry can take hits like a gear and dish it out too.

Badlands Rovers - Badlands rovers usually have second hand gears and are rather rag tag. You will primarily have light tanks, infantry, APC's, and a few gears.

Port Arthur Korps - The PAK is a mixture of CEF hovertanks and GRELs. combined with Northern and Southern gears. They have a lot of flexibility but none of the special equipment of either side. No Battle Frames and no unique gears or vehicles.

Additionally, there are other forces in the game too. There are the Black Talons, Free Humanist Forces, Paxton/Peace River, and specialize forces in the various countries.

Expect to spend about 50 - 100 dollars to get a really good force with a good selection of variety (unless you want to proxy), but you can start playing with and expendature of about 40 bucks. You really only need about 5-15 miniatures to play the game.

For actual force selection I would recommend a few general purpose units (i.e. Hunter, Jager, Warrior, 6-16 Battleframe, etc.), a couple of fire support vehicles (i.e Grizzly, Mammoth, Naga, Spitting Cobra, etc.), a few recon units (cheetah, iguana), and some strike gears (Black Mamba, Jaguar).

I hope this helps... if not... get more specific.

Jonathan

P.S. Keep in mind there are a couple of other miniatures which are fun to have on the table. They are gears like the Kodiak and King Cobra. They are both assualt gears and a lot of fun to have.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 10:52 pm 
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Count Zero wrote:
Northern Forces - Really powerful tanks, and agile gears. The Northern equipment is very much so about precision.

Southern Forces - southern equipment focuses and being brutal. They have high damage indirect weapons.


Ack, well I guess I should look twice at the Norther Forces, much more my style.

Daniel



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PostPosted: Thu Dec 18, 2003 10:57 pm 
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Count Zero wrote:
[quote:51e126fe94="Foxbat"]
One more question. What are the differences between the combat rules for gears in the HG:RPG and HG:Tac? In Jovian Chronicles, the white book space combat rules were pretty heavy duty and thus the release of Lighting Strike. Is this the same reason for the HG rpg and tac rulesets?


Well the rules for HG:Tac are more focused towards Tactical. They have scenario generation and infantry rules (especially compared to the SilCore). It will also have the Threat Values when compared to the current HG books. The old ones still have TV though.

The Lightning Strike rules and hard space rules will be in the book as far as I know. The hard space rules are intended for those who really want realism. They are only intended for a few models at a time. Might be good for about 4-8 models per side (like fighter combat).

Jonathan[/quote:51e126fe94]

I was just curious to see you compare/contrast the relationship between HG:RPG and HG:tac to JC:RPG to JC:tac, since I only have read books on the JC side of things. Close enough.

It was my perception that the detailed combat rule in the JC:RPG were more complex than the Lightning Stike rules and I was curious if the same relationship existed in the HG line.

Daniel



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When a cat is dropped, it always lands on its feet, and when toast is dropped, it always lands with the buttered side facing down. I propose to strap buttered toast to the back of a cat. The two will hover, spinning inches above the ground. With a giant buttered cat array, a high-speed monorail could easily link New York with Chicago.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 5:15 pm 
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Foxbat wrote:
I was just curious to see you compare/contrast the relationship between HG:RPG and HG:tac to JC:RPG to JC:tac, since I only have read books on the JC side of things. Close enough.

It was my perception that the detailed combat rule in the JC:RPG were more complex than the Lightning Stike rules and I was curious if the same relationship existed in the HG line.


Basically it is like this. Heavy Gear was originally designed to be a fully integrated RPG and Tactical system. If you were doing a battle in gears in the RPG then you simply dropped the characters into the game with the skills that were relavent and you played. Effectively, it was two games in one. HG RPG and HG Tac are almost exactly the same. The only thing that is really different is the fact that the tactical book focuses more on a larger battle and has scenario generation rules.

Now the difference between JC and Lighting Strike are significant. While JC was supposed the space equivilant of HG RPG, Lightning Strike is massive fleet action. It is simplified rules for ships, fighters and Exos. The average game of Lightning Strike has about 4-8 ships and about 10-20 fighters/exos. JC is really more of an RPG and the rules there were only meant to be used in some situations. The Lightning Strike rules are rather abstract but have neat aspects like electronic warfare. Lightning Strike is intended to be used separately from JC. They were never really meant to combine with one another.

Jonathan


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 5:17 pm 
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Hey you guys,

If you want to try the games out I will be at Game Towne all next weekend (26-28th) running games for Winterfest. It is a $5 entry and you can win lots of Gift Certificates. I will be more than happy to show you guys all the games DP9 makes. I will be running a Heavy Gear demo on friday if I remember right and some RPG games. I am willing to find the time to show you Lightning Strike if you like.

Jonathan


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 9:29 pm 
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Count Zero,

In your opinion how is the quality of the new 3rd edition HG books? I know from lurking on HGML since 2001 that the perceived quality of the books DP9 has published recently has dimished (layout, typos, deletions, etc). Right now the choice between the 2nd and 3rd edition is somewhat difficult due to the various opinions I have read and my inability to find a local store where I can preview either.

Daniel



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When a cat is dropped, it always lands on its feet, and when toast is dropped, it always lands with the buttered side facing down. I propose to strap buttered toast to the back of a cat. The two will hover, spinning inches above the ground. With a giant buttered cat array, a high-speed monorail could easily link New York with Chicago.
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 19, 2003 9:43 pm 
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Count Zero wrote:
If you want to try the games out I will be at Game Towne all next weekend (26-28th) running games for Winterfest. It is a $5 entry and you can win lots of Gift Certificates. I will be more than happy to show you guys all the games DP9 makes. I will be running a Heavy Gear demo on friday if I remember right and some RPG games. I am willing to find the time to show you Lightning Strike if you like.


Can you post a new thread on Winterfest with as much info as possible as I currently know very little about it.



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PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2003 1:01 pm 
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Foxbat wrote:
Count Zero,

In your opinion how is the quality of the new 3rd edition HG books? I know from lurking on HGML since 2001 that the perceived quality of the books DP9 has published recently has dimished (layout, typos, deletions, etc). Right now the choice between the 2nd and 3rd edition is somewhat difficult due to the various opinions I have read and my inability to find a local store where I can preview either.

Daniel


Actually, I find the 3rd Edition book much better than the 2nd Edition. It does require you to pick up SilCore Rules but the new hardback version is really nice. You get more for your money with the HG 3rd Ed. book. Remember that typos are going to show up in every game book no matter how hard they try. I personally have never really minded typos as long as they aren't truly horrible ones. They are just something that happens sometimes.

Jonathan


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 20, 2003 1:02 pm 
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cczernia wrote:
Can you post a new thread on Winterfest with as much info as possible as I currently know very little about it.


I will have it up this evening...

Jonathan


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 9:53 am 
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Did the HG games come out for any other platform besides the PC? Were they any good?

I picked up Armored Core 2 for $14 at EB the other day. Looks kinda cool. I like AC1. :machineg:



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PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2003 10:11 am 
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DP9 signed an exclusive contract with Activision for games using the Heavy Gear license. The only games published were HG1 and HG2. HG3 was being developed but was cancelled due to poor projected sales. Too bad since HG2 was one of the finest first person mech games ever.

Mech game I have for the PS1 and PS2:

Front Mission 3 (PS1): Good luck finding a new copy anymore. If you see this used, pick it up.
Armored Core 2 (PS2): A lot of fun, especially customizing your mechs.
Armored Core 3 (PS2): More of the same gameplay with better graphics.
Mobile Suit Gundam: Zeonic Front (PS2): A very unusual game for this license. Kind of a combination of Armored Core and Rainbow 6.

Daniel



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When a cat is dropped, it always lands on its feet, and when toast is dropped, it always lands with the buttered side facing down. I propose to strap buttered toast to the back of a cat. The two will hover, spinning inches above the ground. With a giant buttered cat array, a high-speed monorail could easily link New York with Chicago.
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 11:17 am 
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Hey CZ:

Whats the story with the new CEF book? I heard about it last night-$40? Is it compatible with only the new Core Tac book? New frames? i'm still considering jumping back in. It's a toss up between HG and Lightning Strike. Offer still open on the CEF army?



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 2:04 pm 
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It is an awsome book. I picked it up on Sunday.

Totally SilCore compatiable. About 8 Frames. Lots of story material. I know DP9 books are on the expensive side but I would have to admit I have found them to be worth every penny.

C
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 4:39 pm 
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Lowly Uhlan wrote:
Whats the story with the new CEF book? I heard about it last night-$40? Is it compatible with only the new Core Tac book? New frames? i'm still considering jumping back in. It's a toss up between HG and Lightning Strike. Offer still open on the CEF army?


It's $30, not $40. I think it originally planned to be $40 as a hardback but chose softback instead. I don't have the book yet but if the new Core Tac info is similar to the old stuff that just about everything should be compatible for both tactical and rpg versions of a settings.

Chulainn wrote:
I know DP9 books are on the expensive side but I would have to admit I have found them to be worth every penny.


DP9 books use to be expensive when their average book was $22 and most sourcebooks were ranging between $15-$20. That certainly isn't true anymore. The original D&D 3rd splats were $20 for 90 pgs! The new 3.5 splats are $27 for 160 pgs. The Earth Companion is $30 for 256pgs, the average length of a corebook.

A couple companies are a bit cheeper (Hero, White Wolf) but they are the exception, not the d20 rule :)



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PostPosted: Tue Dec 23, 2003 9:30 pm 
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Lowly Uhlan wrote:
Whats the story with the new CEF book? I heard about it last night-$40? Is it compatible with only the new Core Tac book? New frames? i'm still considering jumping back in. It's a toss up between HG and Lightning Strike. Offer still open on the CEF army?


It is more of an RPG resource then a tactical one, but it has the Threat Values for the vehicles and and the stuff from the CEF sourcebook. It is reverse compatible because not much has changed with the new SilCore. The offer for your army back is still open.

Jonathan


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 24, 2003 7:57 am 
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cczernia wrote:
It's $30, not $40. I think it originally planned to be $40 as a hardback but chose softback instead. I don't have the book yet but if the new Core Tac info is similar to the old stuff that just about everything should be compatible for both tactical and rpg versions of a settings.

[quote:66a6efb655="Chulainn"]I know DP9 books are on the expensive side but I would have to admit I have found them to be worth every penny.


DP9 books use to be expensive when their average book was $22 and most sourcebooks were ranging between $15-$20. That certainly isn't true anymore. The original D&D 3rd splats were $20 for 90 pgs! The new 3.5 splats are $27 for 160 pgs. The Earth Companion is $30 for 256pgs, the average length of a corebook.

A couple companies are a bit cheeper (Hero, White Wolf) but they are the exception, not the d20 rule :)[/quote:66a6efb655]


You are quite correct...My Bad. I guess i was just excited to get the book. And yes at $30 is is a great deal.

C
(Sometimes is just plain WRONG)



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2004 8:14 pm 
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Gotetsu wrote:
Did the HG games come out for any other platform besides the PC? Were they any good?

I picked up Armored Core 2 for $14 at EB the other day. Looks kinda cool. I like AC1. :machineg:


HG 1 was alright...not to hot. HG 2 was actually much much better. As for the AC games, they kick so much ass other asses must be imported to keep up with the demand



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PostPosted: Wed Mar 24, 2004 8:53 pm 
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Shin Kenshiro wrote:
HG 1 was alright...not to hot. HG 2 was actually much much better. As for the AC games, they kick so much ass other asses must be imported to keep up with the demand


There were things I liked about both games. While HG 1 kept closer to the aspects of how indirect fire worked, HG 2 kept closer to how gears move and behave more like they should. I would like to take a combination of both and make a kick ass game.

Jonathan


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